I've been watching the politicians talk about 'reforming' healthcare and reading what some friends have been saying on facebook, and I've been getting somewhat frustrated. I don't think the politicans care about reform- they only seem to want to place the federal government in charge of healthcare, and the only reason I can see for that is control.
As for the discussions between my friends, I am noticing a few false arguments, IMO. First, one friend mentioned that the conventional wisdom is that doctors get paid too much. I think it's more that doctors' offices charge too much, and that is more a result of high malpractice insurance premiums, administrative costs to file insurance paperwork and other costs of dealing with insurance companies or the government. I know many doctors offices that have to hire more than one person to file insurance paperwork and appeals. And the 'deals' that insurance companies make with those offices as to how much they will pay, in order for the doctors to be included in the 'in network' list of doctors, aren't very good deals. The Medicare and Medicaid reimbursement deals from the government are even worse- usually below the cost of providing services. In order to make that up, the doctors offices have to charge those not with Medicare or Medicaid, see more patients and find other ways to get money, such as charging copy costs for records. This is more true for hospitals, who cannot choose not to accept Medicare and Medicaid patients, and who must treat everyone regardless of ability to pay. They have to make up the costs elsewhere.
I was really troubled when one friend said that he doesn't understand how universal healthcare takes away freedom from anyone. I think that, anytime anyone other than the doctor and patient make healthcare decisions, freedom is taken away from the patient, and to a degree, from the doctor. The same is true with HMO health insurance plans. I personally will never take an HMO plan, as I want the freedom to choose my doctors. Currently, a large portion of my medical care is not covered by my health insurance plan, and I choose to continue that care, and pay for it myself. I don't think health insurance should determine what care is given- it should just be a tool to help pay for larger unexpected expenses. And healthcare decisions should not be made by bureaucrats anywhere, whether in an HMO or in the government. The stimulus bill included a department of Health Information Technology, whose purpose is to consolidate all medical records in one database and make decisions about healthcare nationwide based on efficiency. I think this should scare anyone who has even a cold, much less other health issues.
As to the argument that we give up freedom for fire protection, so why not for healthcare, I say that fire protection is a local issue, determined on a local level, by local taxes (albeit subsidized by the federal government), and as with the case of my friend who lives in a district with a volunteer fire department, is different based on where one chooses to live. Everyone can vote with their feet as to what level of taxes they want to pay for fire protection, and what level they want. However, with universal healthcare, the taxes are on a federal level, not local, and there is no way to leave, other than leaving the country, which is not an option of many people.
My thoughts on health care reform:
1) Health insurance needs to be Health Insurance- the discussions about healthcare seem to confuse healthcare with health insurance. Insurance is a tool for risk management- the basic principle is to pay a premium to insure that when larger events come along, the majority of the amount will be paid by the insurance company. Insurance is never intended to pay for everything- it should only pay for covered losses, and for items that are possibilities, not known events. And if insurance is used for small items, the premiums will necessarily increase. Pricing is therefore based on the probability of unknown events happening. One option for health insurance would be similar to catastrophe insurance, and would only pay out in the event of hospitalization or serious illness. Higher premiums would allow for lower deductibles, and could cover prescriptions, etc.
2) One of the largest costs doctors pay, is malpractice insurance. In some locations malpractice insurance costs are so high that doctors are choosing to either stop practicing medicine, or moving elsewhere. Tort reform would reduce the costs of malpractice insurance.
3) Government regulation greatly increases the cost of insurance. Because of lobbying, certain groups have ensured that their specialties will be included in all insurance plans, regardless of whether or not the insured wants to pay the premiums for that coverage. For instance, if I knew I couldn't have children, why should I pay for coverage that includes pregnancy care? If I don't want to pay for substance abuse care, why can't I exclude that from my plan? The premiums for plans that do include such coverages would have to account for more adverse selection, as, for example, those with plans to have children would choose pregnancy coverages. However, if I were to get pregnant, I would have to pay for the care myself. Because fewer people would have comprehensive insurance plans, doctors would need fewer people to process claims and appeals.
4) Possibly the most important reform is to separate health insurance from the employer. Employers receive tax benefits for providing health insurance to employees, and individuals do not receive the same tax benefits for obtaining health insurance on their own. In addition, if you work for a large company, you will get a better insurance plan than if you work for a small company, due the the larger pool of participants, and if you work for yourself or for a really small company, you may not even have the option of employer provided insurance, and if you lose your job, you lose that coverage. Insurance should not be tied to employment- to remove it from employment would level the playing field for everyone.
5) a great point from a friend, so I'm co-opting it: ensure that emergency rooms are used for true emergencies, not in place of doctors visits. Not sure the best way to accomplish this, although Urgent Care centers seem to help.
Friday, July 10, 2009
Thursday, July 9, 2009
Conversations on Facebook about Healthcare
M: Question for discussion: In what way does the German system to achieve universal health care coverage restrict freedom?FRONTLINE: sick around the world: interviews: karl lauterbach | PBS
Source: www.pbs.org
Lauterbach, one of Germany's foremost experts on health policy, is a professor of health economics and epidemiology at the University of Cologne and a member of the German parliament. Here he discusses ...
M: Love this pre-election quote from the German: "I think the Democrats will win the
election and they will then not change the system, is my personal view. Then they will lose a lot of credibility."
M: Geeks paid more, work less, & happier than doctors http://bit.ly/eCjVQ
J: does this apply to church geeks too?
M: its all anecdotal, so why not?
G: Powerful commentary. I wasn't smart enough to be a geek, I had to be a doctor. The "geek" in my med school class realized after blowing every curve we had that he was making more money in his side consulting business than he would ever make as a physician. Many docs are very happy, I love being a pediatrician, I have little expectation of ever making more than a comfortable life for my family. But tell me I am the cause of this healthcare mess and you can find someone else to take care of you.
M: the current "crisis" (scare quotes because I'm not completely convinced that we're at the crisis level) probably isn't the fault of pediatricians. And you can tell them I said that, Grant.
I'm still trying to understand why conventional wisdom says doctors earn tons of money when, just from a little research, I can see that isn't the case. Sure, they earn above average, but many plumbers or electricians make as much as a doctor. And there is more room to compete for plumbers and electricians (from what I can see) than doctors.
The real money isn't in medicine: it is in entrepreneurship. Medicine is (from what I can see) a relatively low-risk way for adequately intelligent people to make a comfortable (but not too extravagant) living.
Whereas the ones with tons of money (at the cost of a high chance of failure) are entrepreneurs. And, maybe it is my ignorance, but I don't see lots of room for entrepreneurs in medicine outside of snake oil salesmen.
G: the money in doctoring is on the business side, very astute observation. A poor business minded doctor is soon out of business. The very wealthy physicians are just like wealthy lawyers, they're either in real estate or doing goofy stuff on the side.
M: where "goofy stuff" is a euphemism for... not quite legal?
G: There is a difference between what is ethical and what is legal. Many things are legal that are not ethical. Giving patients antibiotics or pain meds because they want them when research and practice would not warrant them is perfectly legal and a great way to ensure repeat business, spend less time with the patient (ensure more patients per time slot) thereby making more money and is perfectly legal. In fact, much medical research in this area shows that the less time docs spend with patients the more money is spent, tests, medications, repeat visits. In models where physicians are paid for their time, costs go down due to more time to spend with patients to diagnose and educate. I feel very preachy..., Hex, it's been a great discussion!
M: Go on and preach. Your insight is helpful to an ignoramus like me ;)
I'm all for paying by time. I know that I work differently when I'm paid by the hour.
So, question: Pharmacists (I'm related to/know several) seem to be paid the same regardless of experience or negotiations. At least in hospital/retail environs. Which just seems so wrong coming from a field that tends towards meritorious in its compensation model....
In a hospital/clinical setting where the doctors are employees does compensation work the same way? Or is there something else going on? Or is the doctor-as-employee model not used much/at all?
G: Pharmacists that work for chains get productivity points for encouraging shoppers to try certain brands, switch to a particular generic etc. Hosp pharmacists are treated more like supervisors and so get paid that way. Employee physicians have all kinds of arrangements, but usually are less productive than owner physicians. If you don't have a stake in the outcome, why worry about it. This is really why university medical centers are so unproductive. Faculty without productivity incentives may only see 5-10 patients a day, where someone in private practice may see 20-40. Medical centers are starting to learn some economics in this new environment, but old habits die hard.
M: So I need to find a practice that has doctor/owners and bills by the time used.
Thanks, G!
G: You need to find someone you are comfortable with and you like. Someone who will spend the time answering your questions. As a pediatrician, I don't feel like I'm doing a good job until the parents feel like they are doing a good job.
M: US health care ranked 41st by CIA World Factbook. (i.e. not the best in the world) http://bit.ly/uF3JF
K: That's because they are ranking by health care outcomes, not profitability.
M: Dang, you saw through my subterfuge.
K: My health care is great. It could not be better. Of course I pay for the services I want and need
G: The problem with our costs is that what people want is not what they need. True healthcare reform is actually going to cost everyone more, and hopefully significantly reduce use of services like MRIs and medicines. I could talk about this for hours, but won't bore the public with yet another pundit's ideas of what should happen, since that is most certainly what will not happen. Lawyers and insurance companies have too much invested for there to be real reform.
T: My health care is managed by bean counters who frequently override my doctors' judgments. And I'm fortunate to have what is generally regarded as good health insurance.
M: K, your health care may be great, but are you happy to overpay?
I was lucky enough to have health care when I took a table saw to my hand. At the time, I was unemployed and almost had to use the Charity Hospital System in NOLA. Which probably would've gotten me the results I needed since they have great trauma care.
Luckily, I found out I was eligible for COBRA, so I was able to get surgery without humongous wait times. (Also, if you must go to a free hospital, try to make sure you're bleeding when you get there. Learned that one the hard way.)
But what do anecdotes prove? "My health care" is irrelevant, except to me.
Sure, most of us commenting are employed now and can afford the care we need. But that misses the point.
The market isn't providing the best solution (see CIA WFB) and we're over-paying. It doesn't matter whose fault it is.
S: Anyone who thinks they aren't already subsidizing health care for the uninsured/underinsured is fooling themselves. Your taxes are subsidizing it in a very inefficient, expensive way. Speaking as a close relative of an uninsured person with no money and multiple major health problems. He always gets care at the state-funded hospital, very good care, too.
G: Of course we pay a lot to subsidize care in the ER. That is where most of the cost drain is. With appropriate reform the ERs would be closed to non emergent care, everyone would have coverage to have care outside of a hospital where it is most expensive. But, the great part, is that the uninsured will also be paying into the system. Look to the Mass. plan. Everyone is expected to pay in, and that means reduced discretionary income, so maybe no meals out, no 4 wheelers, no fancy car. The people who have complained the most about the Mass. plan are contract workers and freelancers who are expected to pay in 10% of their income (a realistic expectation).
M: still trying to figure out how any health care proposals on the table reduce freedom
K: Reduce freedom for the poor to suffer?
L: As a person with family in Canada I can tell you that their socialized health system is oppressive and values cost over life. I believe our system here needs
reformed - but not socialized.
K: As a long-time American member of an HMO, I can say without reservation (and with some experience) that so does ours.
M: L, gotta say: Krista's right. But, again, I don't think any of the proposals on the table is for a Canada-style system.
K: Nah, a lot of the proposals are a lot more like Germany's system, actually, which, while confusing, seems to work. As a high-risk foreigner, I actually pay quite a bit, and if employed after my probationary period here, I'd still pay quite a bit unless I couldn't afford it, at which point I'd drop into the so-called public system, which has the same care, just paid for differently.
M: Excellent. German engineering applied to Health Care. What could go wrong?
T: There is a good Frontline documentary that covers some of this: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/
Of course the health care proposals reduce freedom as do Medicare and Medicaid. If even one dollar of one's income is "redistributed" to pay for another's healthcare, freedom is trampled. Using "force" of any kind against another individual impairs that person's ability live a free life
M: Kristopher, so I'm confused. Are you saying we should eliminate taxes entirely?
K: No, we need taxes and government. We need a government that can protect me from those individuals (bad guys) or groups (terrorist organizations, invading countries,etc) that want to harm me or my property. We need a standing army, police, fire, and court system.
M: fwiw, in my area, the fire departments are all-volunteer.
So, you're willing to have reduced freedom to fund your fire department?
Isn't it "We the people" who get to decide what freedoms to give up (if we do, in fact, consider taxes a loss of freedom) in return for some benefit, be it police or a fair judicial system? If "we the people" decide we'd like better health care and are willing to pay for it with our tax dollars (i.e. "loss of freedom") then what is the harm? You've already decided you're willing to give up freedom for fire fighters.
K: Fire fighters protect personal property and save people from dying who are in a natural disaster.
M: And doctors save people who are dying of disease. If you're willing to pay for fire departments to "save people from dying", why not health care?
K: Why do doctors save people? For the fun of it? Maybe some. But the majority do it for a profit motive. The government fixes prices and reimbursement. Slowly over time smart and talented people will leave medicine. People who have resources are not clamoring to get their gall bladder out at Walter reed or an Indian hospital. No they go to the most talented skilled professional that their resources will buy.
M: Do you have any statistics to back up your assertion that "the majority do it for a profit motive"? I'm not questioning that people go into medicine for the money: but I don't think that is the primary reason "the majority" chooses the field.
Further, you're assuming that any change in the health care system would necessarily mean less pay for providers. I'm not going to argue that because in a free market system eliminating inefficiencies does reduce costs. If doctors are permitted to compete -- if health care were truly a free market -- then I would expect health care costs to go down and, yes, doctors would be paid less.
Either way, if the government mandates reform or if we institute a truly free-market approach, I would expect doctors to be paid less. The only way to avoid that is to keep the status quo.
K: I don't have any statistics to back up that doctors " do it for the money". We can do an experiment though. Next time u go to the doctor make it clear that u have no intention of paying nor do u think he or she should be paid what he is charging. Tell me about the care u receive or how quickly u are shown the door
M: What about the rest of what I said: that Drs will inevitably be paid less?
M: Also refusing to provide service if I refuse to pay is not the same as providing care only because of money.
K: That is already happening. Physician reimbursment has been falling for 20 years
K: If the only variable that changes is your refusal to pay, one must conclude that "they are doing it for the money"
M: Yet, somehow, people have been going into medicine still. Evidence suggests (http://www.tcf.org/list.asp?type=NC&pubid=1733) that there are too many doctors.
So, obviously, they are still paid too much. An over-supply means that there will be a reduction in costs.
M: but we've gotten off track: how does any of this support the idea that changing the health care system reduces freedom?
Source: www.pbs.org
Lauterbach, one of Germany's foremost experts on health policy, is a professor of health economics and epidemiology at the University of Cologne and a member of the German parliament. Here he discusses ...
M: Love this pre-election quote from the German: "I think the Democrats will win the
election and they will then not change the system, is my personal view. Then they will lose a lot of credibility."
M: Geeks paid more, work less, & happier than doctors http://bit.ly/eCjVQ
J: does this apply to church geeks too?
M: its all anecdotal, so why not?
G: Powerful commentary. I wasn't smart enough to be a geek, I had to be a doctor. The "geek" in my med school class realized after blowing every curve we had that he was making more money in his side consulting business than he would ever make as a physician. Many docs are very happy, I love being a pediatrician, I have little expectation of ever making more than a comfortable life for my family. But tell me I am the cause of this healthcare mess and you can find someone else to take care of you.
M: the current "crisis" (scare quotes because I'm not completely convinced that we're at the crisis level) probably isn't the fault of pediatricians. And you can tell them I said that, Grant.
I'm still trying to understand why conventional wisdom says doctors earn tons of money when, just from a little research, I can see that isn't the case. Sure, they earn above average, but many plumbers or electricians make as much as a doctor. And there is more room to compete for plumbers and electricians (from what I can see) than doctors.
The real money isn't in medicine: it is in entrepreneurship. Medicine is (from what I can see) a relatively low-risk way for adequately intelligent people to make a comfortable (but not too extravagant) living.
Whereas the ones with tons of money (at the cost of a high chance of failure) are entrepreneurs. And, maybe it is my ignorance, but I don't see lots of room for entrepreneurs in medicine outside of snake oil salesmen.
G: the money in doctoring is on the business side, very astute observation. A poor business minded doctor is soon out of business. The very wealthy physicians are just like wealthy lawyers, they're either in real estate or doing goofy stuff on the side.
M: where "goofy stuff" is a euphemism for... not quite legal?
G: There is a difference between what is ethical and what is legal. Many things are legal that are not ethical. Giving patients antibiotics or pain meds because they want them when research and practice would not warrant them is perfectly legal and a great way to ensure repeat business, spend less time with the patient (ensure more patients per time slot) thereby making more money and is perfectly legal. In fact, much medical research in this area shows that the less time docs spend with patients the more money is spent, tests, medications, repeat visits. In models where physicians are paid for their time, costs go down due to more time to spend with patients to diagnose and educate. I feel very preachy..., Hex, it's been a great discussion!
M: Go on and preach. Your insight is helpful to an ignoramus like me ;)
I'm all for paying by time. I know that I work differently when I'm paid by the hour.
So, question: Pharmacists (I'm related to/know several) seem to be paid the same regardless of experience or negotiations. At least in hospital/retail environs. Which just seems so wrong coming from a field that tends towards meritorious in its compensation model....
In a hospital/clinical setting where the doctors are employees does compensation work the same way? Or is there something else going on? Or is the doctor-as-employee model not used much/at all?
G: Pharmacists that work for chains get productivity points for encouraging shoppers to try certain brands, switch to a particular generic etc. Hosp pharmacists are treated more like supervisors and so get paid that way. Employee physicians have all kinds of arrangements, but usually are less productive than owner physicians. If you don't have a stake in the outcome, why worry about it. This is really why university medical centers are so unproductive. Faculty without productivity incentives may only see 5-10 patients a day, where someone in private practice may see 20-40. Medical centers are starting to learn some economics in this new environment, but old habits die hard.
M: So I need to find a practice that has doctor/owners and bills by the time used.
Thanks, G!
G: You need to find someone you are comfortable with and you like. Someone who will spend the time answering your questions. As a pediatrician, I don't feel like I'm doing a good job until the parents feel like they are doing a good job.
M: US health care ranked 41st by CIA World Factbook. (i.e. not the best in the world) http://bit.ly/uF3JF
K: That's because they are ranking by health care outcomes, not profitability.
M: Dang, you saw through my subterfuge.
K: My health care is great. It could not be better. Of course I pay for the services I want and need
G: The problem with our costs is that what people want is not what they need. True healthcare reform is actually going to cost everyone more, and hopefully significantly reduce use of services like MRIs and medicines. I could talk about this for hours, but won't bore the public with yet another pundit's ideas of what should happen, since that is most certainly what will not happen. Lawyers and insurance companies have too much invested for there to be real reform.
T: My health care is managed by bean counters who frequently override my doctors' judgments. And I'm fortunate to have what is generally regarded as good health insurance.
M: K, your health care may be great, but are you happy to overpay?
I was lucky enough to have health care when I took a table saw to my hand. At the time, I was unemployed and almost had to use the Charity Hospital System in NOLA. Which probably would've gotten me the results I needed since they have great trauma care.
Luckily, I found out I was eligible for COBRA, so I was able to get surgery without humongous wait times. (Also, if you must go to a free hospital, try to make sure you're bleeding when you get there. Learned that one the hard way.)
But what do anecdotes prove? "My health care" is irrelevant, except to me.
Sure, most of us commenting are employed now and can afford the care we need. But that misses the point.
The market isn't providing the best solution (see CIA WFB) and we're over-paying. It doesn't matter whose fault it is.
S: Anyone who thinks they aren't already subsidizing health care for the uninsured/underinsured is fooling themselves. Your taxes are subsidizing it in a very inefficient, expensive way. Speaking as a close relative of an uninsured person with no money and multiple major health problems. He always gets care at the state-funded hospital, very good care, too.
G: Of course we pay a lot to subsidize care in the ER. That is where most of the cost drain is. With appropriate reform the ERs would be closed to non emergent care, everyone would have coverage to have care outside of a hospital where it is most expensive. But, the great part, is that the uninsured will also be paying into the system. Look to the Mass. plan. Everyone is expected to pay in, and that means reduced discretionary income, so maybe no meals out, no 4 wheelers, no fancy car. The people who have complained the most about the Mass. plan are contract workers and freelancers who are expected to pay in 10% of their income (a realistic expectation).
M: still trying to figure out how any health care proposals on the table reduce freedom
K: Reduce freedom for the poor to suffer?
L: As a person with family in Canada I can tell you that their socialized health system is oppressive and values cost over life. I believe our system here needs
reformed - but not socialized.
K: As a long-time American member of an HMO, I can say without reservation (and with some experience) that so does ours.
M: L, gotta say: Krista's right. But, again, I don't think any of the proposals on the table is for a Canada-style system.
K: Nah, a lot of the proposals are a lot more like Germany's system, actually, which, while confusing, seems to work. As a high-risk foreigner, I actually pay quite a bit, and if employed after my probationary period here, I'd still pay quite a bit unless I couldn't afford it, at which point I'd drop into the so-called public system, which has the same care, just paid for differently.
M: Excellent. German engineering applied to Health Care. What could go wrong?
T: There is a good Frontline documentary that covers some of this: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/sickaroundtheworld/
Of course the health care proposals reduce freedom as do Medicare and Medicaid. If even one dollar of one's income is "redistributed" to pay for another's healthcare, freedom is trampled. Using "force" of any kind against another individual impairs that person's ability live a free life
M: Kristopher, so I'm confused. Are you saying we should eliminate taxes entirely?
K: No, we need taxes and government. We need a government that can protect me from those individuals (bad guys) or groups (terrorist organizations, invading countries,etc) that want to harm me or my property. We need a standing army, police, fire, and court system.
M: fwiw, in my area, the fire departments are all-volunteer.
So, you're willing to have reduced freedom to fund your fire department?
Isn't it "We the people" who get to decide what freedoms to give up (if we do, in fact, consider taxes a loss of freedom) in return for some benefit, be it police or a fair judicial system? If "we the people" decide we'd like better health care and are willing to pay for it with our tax dollars (i.e. "loss of freedom") then what is the harm? You've already decided you're willing to give up freedom for fire fighters.
K: Fire fighters protect personal property and save people from dying who are in a natural disaster.
M: And doctors save people who are dying of disease. If you're willing to pay for fire departments to "save people from dying", why not health care?
K: Why do doctors save people? For the fun of it? Maybe some. But the majority do it for a profit motive. The government fixes prices and reimbursement. Slowly over time smart and talented people will leave medicine. People who have resources are not clamoring to get their gall bladder out at Walter reed or an Indian hospital. No they go to the most talented skilled professional that their resources will buy.
M: Do you have any statistics to back up your assertion that "the majority do it for a profit motive"? I'm not questioning that people go into medicine for the money: but I don't think that is the primary reason "the majority" chooses the field.
Further, you're assuming that any change in the health care system would necessarily mean less pay for providers. I'm not going to argue that because in a free market system eliminating inefficiencies does reduce costs. If doctors are permitted to compete -- if health care were truly a free market -- then I would expect health care costs to go down and, yes, doctors would be paid less.
Either way, if the government mandates reform or if we institute a truly free-market approach, I would expect doctors to be paid less. The only way to avoid that is to keep the status quo.
K: I don't have any statistics to back up that doctors " do it for the money". We can do an experiment though. Next time u go to the doctor make it clear that u have no intention of paying nor do u think he or she should be paid what he is charging. Tell me about the care u receive or how quickly u are shown the door
M: What about the rest of what I said: that Drs will inevitably be paid less?
M: Also refusing to provide service if I refuse to pay is not the same as providing care only because of money.
K: That is already happening. Physician reimbursment has been falling for 20 years
K: If the only variable that changes is your refusal to pay, one must conclude that "they are doing it for the money"
M: Yet, somehow, people have been going into medicine still. Evidence suggests (http://www.tcf.org/list.asp?type=NC&pubid=1733) that there are too many doctors.
So, obviously, they are still paid too much. An over-supply means that there will be a reduction in costs.
M: but we've gotten off track: how does any of this support the idea that changing the health care system reduces freedom?
Tuesday, July 7, 2009
Letter regarding tea parties- get involved!
Sent: 7/4/2009 9:04:25 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time
Subj: Tea Party Experience
Hi ya'll,
Well, yesterday I attended my first Tea Party (Taxed Enough Already) and learned a great deal.
One thing I learned was there are a lot of people who are really upset with the way things are going in Washington. They are beginning to do something about that and as a result there are many grassroots organizations popping up all over America, all having the desire to return America to our Constitutional Republic. This Tea Party was not put on by a political party. It was a purely volunteer effort.
Another thing I learned was that I am not alone. There were over 7,000 people attending (see attached pics). All of the people who spoke (except for the MC and the Key Note) were folks just like me...people with jobs, with families, with hopes and dreams. And each person who spoke did so because of the growing concern that our freedoms and liberties were being dismantled piece by piece. One thing all of the speakers had in common was a love of country and a love of liberty. This has motivated them to study, to learn, to stand up, and to speak out. One was a self-taught Constitutional expert/historian who spoke of our heritage. One was an Army Captain/Medical officer (retired) who spoke on the VA health care system as an example of government run health care. Another speaker was a 14 year old boy who was probably more knowledgeable on American history than everyone in the crowd.
Another thing I learned was it's not too late to stop the destruction of America as we know it. But, the only way for this to happen is for people like you and me to get involved. Most folks consider it their patriotic duty to vote at every election, and that is true. But then most folks sit back and don't stay involved or are even aware of what happens between elections. Well, and here is the kicker...Our government is "...of the people, by the people, and for the people..." (as Lincoln said in the Gettysburg Address). That implies a bit more involvement. Congress works for us. The President works for us. If America were a true corporation we (the American people) would be fired! Why? Because we, the owners, have allowed the "employees" to run roughshod over the whole purpose and intent of our company. So, what can we do? How can we be heard? Do you feel impotent when it comes to impacting "our corporation"? Here are some suggestions: 1. Educate yourself on what goes on in Washington. What bills are being discussed? What direction are we going? 2. Educate yourself on American history. Read the Declaration of Independence. Read the Constitution. Read biographies of our founders. 3. Find out who your Congressman is and learn how to contact him/her. 4. Do the same for your two Senators. 5. Contact them regularly by phone, by email, by fax, and if you have the chance, in person. 6. Find others in your community who are like-minded and join them. 7. Get involved. 8. If you are in agreement with your Representative and Senators don't sit back and do nothing. Contact your friends and family about issues. Encourage them to contact their elected officials too (that's why I'm sending this to you). 9. Use the Internet to study, to learn, to become active and to make contact.
America is the greatest nation on earth. We are blessed with freedoms and liberty. That is why so many want to come here, and that is why so many want to tear us down. America belongs to its people. We are America. Let me encourage each of you to get involved. Let your voice be heard.
Slater
Subj: Tea Party Experience
Hi ya'll,
Well, yesterday I attended my first Tea Party (Taxed Enough Already) and learned a great deal.
One thing I learned was there are a lot of people who are really upset with the way things are going in Washington. They are beginning to do something about that and as a result there are many grassroots organizations popping up all over America, all having the desire to return America to our Constitutional Republic. This Tea Party was not put on by a political party. It was a purely volunteer effort.
Another thing I learned was that I am not alone. There were over 7,000 people attending (see attached pics). All of the people who spoke (except for the MC and the Key Note) were folks just like me...people with jobs, with families, with hopes and dreams. And each person who spoke did so because of the growing concern that our freedoms and liberties were being dismantled piece by piece. One thing all of the speakers had in common was a love of country and a love of liberty. This has motivated them to study, to learn, to stand up, and to speak out. One was a self-taught Constitutional expert/historian who spoke of our heritage. One was an Army Captain/Medical officer (retired) who spoke on the VA health care system as an example of government run health care. Another speaker was a 14 year old boy who was probably more knowledgeable on American history than everyone in the crowd.
Another thing I learned was it's not too late to stop the destruction of America as we know it. But, the only way for this to happen is for people like you and me to get involved. Most folks consider it their patriotic duty to vote at every election, and that is true. But then most folks sit back and don't stay involved or are even aware of what happens between elections. Well, and here is the kicker...Our government is "...of the people, by the people, and for the people..." (as Lincoln said in the Gettysburg Address). That implies a bit more involvement. Congress works for us. The President works for us. If America were a true corporation we (the American people) would be fired! Why? Because we, the owners, have allowed the "employees" to run roughshod over the whole purpose and intent of our company. So, what can we do? How can we be heard? Do you feel impotent when it comes to impacting "our corporation"? Here are some suggestions: 1. Educate yourself on what goes on in Washington. What bills are being discussed? What direction are we going? 2. Educate yourself on American history. Read the Declaration of Independence. Read the Constitution. Read biographies of our founders. 3. Find out who your Congressman is and learn how to contact him/her. 4. Do the same for your two Senators. 5. Contact them regularly by phone, by email, by fax, and if you have the chance, in person. 6. Find others in your community who are like-minded and join them. 7. Get involved. 8. If you are in agreement with your Representative and Senators don't sit back and do nothing. Contact your friends and family about issues. Encourage them to contact their elected officials too (that's why I'm sending this to you). 9. Use the Internet to study, to learn, to become active and to make contact.
America is the greatest nation on earth. We are blessed with freedoms and liberty. That is why so many want to come here, and that is why so many want to tear us down. America belongs to its people. We are America. Let me encourage each of you to get involved. Let your voice be heard.
Slater
Friday, May 1, 2009
DHS paper- shows government afraid of patriotic movements
The DHS paper on Right Wing Extremism was requested by the Bush administration, but not completed until this April,. and released just before the Tax Day Tea Parties.
Dprogram.net has an article about it and the other DHS paper on Left Wing Extremism.
While there is a legitimate argument that this paper was not requested by the Obama administration, I am still concerned about the timing of its release, and about the statements therein. I understand that there is a reason to be concerned about the fringe elements who are willing to use violence to obtain the results they desire. And there have been some militants who have caused deaths and damage with their actions. But I worry that DHS is demonizing certain groups. And I guess it could be argued that is exactly what DHS was created to do.
However, the most interesting part of this article is near the end (emphasis mine):
And I think that our elected representatives, and those they have appointed, should realize this threat, because it is very real- we are very angry and we want our constitutionally limited Republic back. But I would say 99.9%, maybe more, of us, do not want to use violence to get our Republic back. Unfortunately, those .1% may cause problems for the rest of us. And I don't know how to stop them.
Darn fringiest of fringes- go home and shut up, please!
Dprogram.net has an article about it and the other DHS paper on Left Wing Extremism.
While there is a legitimate argument that this paper was not requested by the Obama administration, I am still concerned about the timing of its release, and about the statements therein. I understand that there is a reason to be concerned about the fringe elements who are willing to use violence to obtain the results they desire. And there have been some militants who have caused deaths and damage with their actions. But I worry that DHS is demonizing certain groups. And I guess it could be argued that is exactly what DHS was created to do.
However, the most interesting part of this article is near the end (emphasis mine):
Demonizing and criminalizing the patriot movement – characterizing them as “rightwing extremists” and white supremacists with the help of SPLC and ADL propaganda – is a last ditch effort on the part of the globalists and international bankers in control of the government. Our rulers realize the threat posed by a large grassroots movement – especially one including veterans – demanding less government intrusion in our lives and a return to a constitutionally limited Republic.
And I think that our elected representatives, and those they have appointed, should realize this threat, because it is very real- we are very angry and we want our constitutionally limited Republic back. But I would say 99.9%, maybe more, of us, do not want to use violence to get our Republic back. Unfortunately, those .1% may cause problems for the rest of us. And I don't know how to stop them.
Darn fringiest of fringes- go home and shut up, please!
Friday, April 24, 2009
My facebook rant
I accidentally retweeted the following tweet on facebook where I have a lot of liberal friends:
One friend replied:
The more I thought about his comment, the more I got upset, so here's what I sent him:
I could have gone on for quite a while, but I've been tired today and my energy ran out. But I have issues with almost all politicians these days. I was reading an article by a liberal who was trying to understand why conservatives are tea-partying and it reminded me of some things that pissed me off about GWB: Medicare Part B, out of control spending and saying that deficits don't matter, cronyism, etc. This guy mentions that conservatives justified tax cuts in 2001 based on huge surpluses- I read somewhere that Reagan wanted to cut taxes so that the government wouldn't have as much money to spend, but it ended up bringing in more revenue. But tax cuts aren't about revenue as much as about where the money is going. Large tax increases to pay for pork or universal healthcare which takes away freedom from me and mine- those I disagree with. Large tax increases to pay for protecting the country- those I can get behind.
RT @KatyinIndy @MargieThiel: BO is a nightmare. a self-absorb ego-maniac who is putting our country at risk by his actions.
One friend replied:
Blame the one in power nevermind the chaos that was left behind by GWB.
The more I thought about his comment, the more I got upset, so here's what I sent him:
I blame GWB for some things, most especially for not being conservative enough (i.e. amnesty), I blame politicians who have been in power for too long and have forgotten who they represent, I blame the American people for being complacent and not speaking up, and I blame myself for not getting involved sooner.
But I blame Obama for pissing off our allies, and trying to be friends with our enemies thus giving them power in their fight against us and the American way of life. I blame Obama for putting imconpetent people in his cabinet like Geithner who can't pay his taxes but wants to tell us how to pay ours, or Hillary who apologizes for America everywhere she goes, or Napolitano who is in charge of Border security but can't tell you where the 9-11 hijackers came into the US.
I blame Obama for lying to the American people and saying his bill is stimulus when it is mostly (88% or so) going to thank those who got him elected (like unions) and to pork projects of democrat senators and representatives. I blame Obama for not respecting the office of US President, for bowing to a Saudi King (never before done by a US ... Read MorePresident), for not protecting the CIA thus hampering them in their fight against terrorists. I blame Obama for his administration's plan to tax energy which will cost the average household $1900 more per year (Cap and Trade).
I blame the media for not reporting the truth, for not even trying to hide their bias, and I blame the people who only listen to the main stream media, and refuse to think for themselves.
And I blame myself for getting angry instead of trying to have an intelligent dialogue.
I could have gone on for quite a while, but I've been tired today and my energy ran out. But I have issues with almost all politicians these days. I was reading an article by a liberal who was trying to understand why conservatives are tea-partying and it reminded me of some things that pissed me off about GWB: Medicare Part B, out of control spending and saying that deficits don't matter, cronyism, etc. This guy mentions that conservatives justified tax cuts in 2001 based on huge surpluses- I read somewhere that Reagan wanted to cut taxes so that the government wouldn't have as much money to spend, but it ended up bringing in more revenue. But tax cuts aren't about revenue as much as about where the money is going. Large tax increases to pay for pork or universal healthcare which takes away freedom from me and mine- those I disagree with. Large tax increases to pay for protecting the country- those I can get behind.
Thursday, April 23, 2009
What if...
I've had a lot of thoughts running through my head lately. Thoughts about what my place in the world is- where do I belong, what am I supposed to be doing.
I have a book I've been working on, but I've been preoccupied with Twitter and the political situation.
I've noticed a lot of people complaining, me too, and a lot of people are frustrated. Many people don't really understand what is going on, and are only repeating what they have heard, rather than trying to figure out the truth.
So I've been wondering about starting a website/blog/twitter account, something along the lines of waking up America. A site with suggestions for people to help them wake up; suggestions for how each person can make a difference in the world around them- volunteering, donating, looking at the world a bit differently, getting involved.
Maybe suggesting charities to get involved in, things anyone can do if they have an hour or two, or $10. New ways to look at old ideas. ways to improve the world around us.
I'll have more on this later. Still thinking it through.
I have a book I've been working on, but I've been preoccupied with Twitter and the political situation.
I've noticed a lot of people complaining, me too, and a lot of people are frustrated. Many people don't really understand what is going on, and are only repeating what they have heard, rather than trying to figure out the truth.
So I've been wondering about starting a website/blog/twitter account, something along the lines of waking up America. A site with suggestions for people to help them wake up; suggestions for how each person can make a difference in the world around them- volunteering, donating, looking at the world a bit differently, getting involved.
Maybe suggesting charities to get involved in, things anyone can do if they have an hour or two, or $10. New ways to look at old ideas. ways to improve the world around us.
I'll have more on this later. Still thinking it through.
Sunday, April 19, 2009
Howard Kempf's speech from Savannah Tea Party
To My Elected Leaders
Your constituents have raised their voices and it is time that you hear us and respond. The Government leaders, both Democrat and Republican, have embraced an attitude of superiority. Despite words of humility, I have seen both Democrats and Republicans do more of what was personally and politically advantageous than what was truly what the people wanted and in the peoples best interest. I understand that there are exceptions to that statement, but they are the exception. The majority of the blame falls on the citizenry who have allowed you, our elected leaders, to work with near impunity. How many members of our government have made a career out of “public service”? Far too many! In contrast, how many have actually experienced private life for more than a brief moment in their youth or in the beginning of their political careers and truly understand what it takes to make it day by day? Not enough! Though our founding fathers possessed many viewpoints and negotiated many compromises in the designing of the Declaration of Independence and our Constitution, the one thing that they all agreed upon was that the survival of the Republic depended not upon the abilities of the government but rather the involvement of its citizens.
WE THE PEOPLE have been remiss.
We have allowed YOU our elected leaders to become complacent and comfortable.
We have allowed YOU our elected leaders to elevate yourselves above the PEOPLE.
We have allowed YOU our elected leaders to think of yourselves as American Nobility.
WE THE PEOPLE say NO MORE!
Hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of your constituents, your bosses, the PEOPLE who elected you are coming together and meeting in all 50 states and D.C on April 15th, Tax Day (the most unholy day of the year on the American calendar), to come together as ONE VOICE. WE THE PEOPLE are tired and angry and are no longer willing to stand by while you dictate to us the terms by which you will govern those who elected you to govern.
WE THE PEOPLE have had enough of your empty campaign promises of remaking Washington DC - a political mantra I have heard as long as I can remember. With the exception of a few men and women, Washington is still the same as it has been for quite some time - selfish and self-serving. At a time when he could have become military dictator or King, George Washington relinquished power and submitted to the Continental Congress. Though weak and divided, the Continental Congress represented the will of the PEOPLE and, as such, was supreme in Washington’s eyes. Given similar circumstances, I wonder which of our elected leaders would gladly give up their office and the lifetime comforts and privileges therein, not denied them by the PEOPLE and most often afforded to themselves by their own hand, for the benefit of the Republic and the freedom and prosperity of the PEOPLE. I suspect that not many would. In my short 48 years, I have yet to see a politician relinquish their office, other than to avoid prosecution and/or further personal and professional embarrassment. Both Republican and Democrat need to take deep, introspective looks within themselves and have the personal courage and moral integrity to take appropriate action. There are few politicians, if any, that should consider themselves faultless as America now faces one of the most economically and politically fragile times in our history both here and abroad.
We have heard over the past few months our elected leaders, blaming not only each other, but also the PEOPLE, while each contending that they themselves are blameless and acting in everyone’s best interest. Now, like no other time in our history, we need elected leaders that value the ideals of LIFE, LIBERTY and the pursuit of HAPPINESS and the welfare of the Republic over their personal and professional goals. You sit in your offices, secure in your salary increases, your pensions, your life and medical insurance for life and your innumerable opportunities for financial prosperity resulting from the celebrity gained through your service, while WE THE PEOPLE work, struggle and produce all the wealth and opportunities from which your personal and professional prosperity is derived.
Well your time has come.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of your campaign rhetoric and false promises.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of the partisan blame game.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of non-solutions, which cost more and do less.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of programs that make us dependent on you.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of big government and little people.
WE THE PEOPLE will no longer be silent, will no longer be content to live our lives and hope for the best. WE THE PEOPLE are standing up and saying to you:
Your political futures are looking grim. It is time to clean house from the White House to the State House to City Hall. It is time for you to take this seriously.
HEED THE VOICES OF WE THE PEOPLE
OR BE PREPARED TO SEEK EMPLOYMENT ELSEWHERE.
Yours in Liberty
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=607454645#/note.php?note_id=78271146174&ref=mf
Your constituents have raised their voices and it is time that you hear us and respond. The Government leaders, both Democrat and Republican, have embraced an attitude of superiority. Despite words of humility, I have seen both Democrats and Republicans do more of what was personally and politically advantageous than what was truly what the people wanted and in the peoples best interest. I understand that there are exceptions to that statement, but they are the exception. The majority of the blame falls on the citizenry who have allowed you, our elected leaders, to work with near impunity. How many members of our government have made a career out of “public service”? Far too many! In contrast, how many have actually experienced private life for more than a brief moment in their youth or in the beginning of their political careers and truly understand what it takes to make it day by day? Not enough! Though our founding fathers possessed many viewpoints and negotiated many compromises in the designing of the Declaration of Independence and our Constitution, the one thing that they all agreed upon was that the survival of the Republic depended not upon the abilities of the government but rather the involvement of its citizens.
WE THE PEOPLE have been remiss.
We have allowed YOU our elected leaders to become complacent and comfortable.
We have allowed YOU our elected leaders to elevate yourselves above the PEOPLE.
We have allowed YOU our elected leaders to think of yourselves as American Nobility.
WE THE PEOPLE say NO MORE!
Hundreds of thousands, perhaps millions of your constituents, your bosses, the PEOPLE who elected you are coming together and meeting in all 50 states and D.C on April 15th, Tax Day (the most unholy day of the year on the American calendar), to come together as ONE VOICE. WE THE PEOPLE are tired and angry and are no longer willing to stand by while you dictate to us the terms by which you will govern those who elected you to govern.
WE THE PEOPLE have had enough of your empty campaign promises of remaking Washington DC - a political mantra I have heard as long as I can remember. With the exception of a few men and women, Washington is still the same as it has been for quite some time - selfish and self-serving. At a time when he could have become military dictator or King, George Washington relinquished power and submitted to the Continental Congress. Though weak and divided, the Continental Congress represented the will of the PEOPLE and, as such, was supreme in Washington’s eyes. Given similar circumstances, I wonder which of our elected leaders would gladly give up their office and the lifetime comforts and privileges therein, not denied them by the PEOPLE and most often afforded to themselves by their own hand, for the benefit of the Republic and the freedom and prosperity of the PEOPLE. I suspect that not many would. In my short 48 years, I have yet to see a politician relinquish their office, other than to avoid prosecution and/or further personal and professional embarrassment. Both Republican and Democrat need to take deep, introspective looks within themselves and have the personal courage and moral integrity to take appropriate action. There are few politicians, if any, that should consider themselves faultless as America now faces one of the most economically and politically fragile times in our history both here and abroad.
We have heard over the past few months our elected leaders, blaming not only each other, but also the PEOPLE, while each contending that they themselves are blameless and acting in everyone’s best interest. Now, like no other time in our history, we need elected leaders that value the ideals of LIFE, LIBERTY and the pursuit of HAPPINESS and the welfare of the Republic over their personal and professional goals. You sit in your offices, secure in your salary increases, your pensions, your life and medical insurance for life and your innumerable opportunities for financial prosperity resulting from the celebrity gained through your service, while WE THE PEOPLE work, struggle and produce all the wealth and opportunities from which your personal and professional prosperity is derived.
Well your time has come.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of your campaign rhetoric and false promises.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of the partisan blame game.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of non-solutions, which cost more and do less.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of programs that make us dependent on you.
WE THE PEOPLE are tired of big government and little people.
WE THE PEOPLE will no longer be silent, will no longer be content to live our lives and hope for the best. WE THE PEOPLE are standing up and saying to you:
Your political futures are looking grim. It is time to clean house from the White House to the State House to City Hall. It is time for you to take this seriously.
HEED THE VOICES OF WE THE PEOPLE
OR BE PREPARED TO SEEK EMPLOYMENT ELSEWHERE.
Yours in Liberty
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=607454645#/note.php?note_id=78271146174&ref=mf
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